|
Post by gazbrewer on Sept 14, 2015 10:57:10 GMT
Not that I expect Burton to go up this year, if we ever did go up to the championship, even for one season, it seems it would change the Pirelli Stadium forever. From what I can see, any club promoted to the Championship must go all-seater within 3 years, even if they are relegated back to League One after one season. Would be a bit harsh IMO for little clubs like us, Fleetwood, etc that may one day just pop up for a season.
|
|
|
Post by cbh1 on Sept 14, 2015 11:51:25 GMT
Interesting point that Gaz. Wonder if the rule still applies if you drop further back into League 2 seeing as Yeovil have not seated their away end yet and this is their second year out of the Championship having had two successive relegations. Three sides of Huish Park are seated but behind the goal is still an open terrace, unchanged from when we went there in the Conference days if memory serves me right.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 12:42:50 GMT
Scunthorpe's home end is still terraced and they got relegated to league one in 2011. This is their 5th season away from the championship. I think they planned to make that stand all seater but ditched it when they went down.
|
|
scoot
Schoolboy Papers
Posts: 55
|
Post by scoot on Sept 14, 2015 14:15:26 GMT
I dont think you have to convert even if you come straight back down. Its just if you return to the Championship in the future you only get 2 seasons to convert to all seater.
"Clubs promoted to the Championship for the first time have three years to convert their ground to all-seated.
If a club is relegated before the three years has expired, and at the time it is relegated it has not yet converted its ground to all seated, when it is next promoted any time previously spent in the Championship or Premiership is counted towards the three years."
So Yeovil have only spent 1 season in the championship. If they ever make it back there they would only have 2 seasons to convert.
Scunthorpe have had their 3 seasons in the championship so would need to convert immediately upon a return to the championship or would only be allowed to have seated sections open.
As far as I understand it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 15:28:35 GMT
And Scunthorpe are moving to a new ground aren't they ?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 17:22:52 GMT
I had thought the 'rule' was that if a club stayed in theChampionship for 3 consecutive years, but scoots post clears that up.
And there is a push by some to get standing in terraces back into the game in all leagues like they do in Germany etc.
|
|
|
Post by A38 on Sept 14, 2015 21:06:29 GMT
Regardless of promotion, one thing that feels like it merits investment ground wise is the food & beverage sales capability. Every time I see the snaking queue from the serving hatch behind the west stand (which has been sparsely populated recently) it strikes me that there must be a case commercially for increasing throughput and therefore revenue.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 21:35:18 GMT
Only two teams in the Football League had a lower attendance than us on Saturday. There is a massive perspective when you realise that and the issues we face when we discuss major stadium changes.
On the positive side, there are sonly 26 teams between us and Chelsea.
|
|
|
Post by NobodyGood on Sept 14, 2015 22:48:31 GMT
Regardless of promotion, one thing that feels like it merits investment ground wise is the food & beverage sales capability. Every time I see the snaking queue from the serving hatch behind the west stand (which has been sparsely populated recently) it strikes me that there must be a case commercially for increasing throughput and therefore revenue. Any suggestions? I know a girl who works there so can pass ideas on. My only thought would be a constant lineup of chips ready under a hot light to speed up serving. Same with pies etc. They'll sell fast anyway.. I'm not sure it would increase revenue though. If people want a pie, they'll queue.
|
|
|
Post by NobodyGood on Sept 14, 2015 22:49:15 GMT
Only two teams in the Football League had a lower attendance than us on Saturday. There is a massive perspective when you realise that and a massive issues when we discuss major stadium changes. On the positive side, there are sonly 26 teams between us and Chelsea. A shame... How the heck do we increase attendances? Imo the only way is to be better than Derby....
|
|
|
Post by A38 on Sept 15, 2015 8:02:22 GMT
Regardless of promotion, one thing that feels like it merits investment ground wise is the food & beverage sales capability. Every time I see the snaking queue from the serving hatch behind the west stand (which has been sparsely populated recently) it strikes me that there must be a case commercially for increasing throughput and therefore revenue. Any suggestions? I know a girl who works there so can pass ideas on. My only thought would be a constant lineup of chips ready under a hot light to speed up serving. Same with pies etc. They'll sell fast anyway.. I'm not sure it would increase revenue though. If people want a pie, they'll queue. To be honest I was thinking more about investing in physically widening the facility... I think my perception has been unrealistically skewed though (given that Oakwell is 3 x the capacity and a former Premier League ground!) by going to the Barnsley game last month, where the outlet for the away fans was very big and remarkably well staffed for our 300-400 attendance! Since the opportunity is there though my feedback is that on the odd occasion I've braved the queue for a half time coffee, the staff have been friendly and I like their Pirelli-branded attire!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2015 8:41:14 GMT
The club does take note A38, the pop side facilities were extended last season after a fans forum. I guess it is all about revenue v cost. There is a short window pre game and a very tight window at half time. In the meantime though the staff have to be there all of the time.
|
|
|
Post by johnno on Sept 15, 2015 10:29:05 GMT
Only two teams in the Football League had a lower attendance than us on Saturday. There is a massive perspective when you realise that and a massive issues when we discuss major stadium changes. On the positive side, there are sonly 26 teams between us and Chelsea. A shame... How the heck do we increase attendances? Imo the only way is to be better than Derby.... I wish we had the answer to that one, as the standard of football and our position in League One really does deserve so much better? I know we always have the Derby syndrome to contend with and sadly for us teams like Leicester are vastly improved but you would think that a town like Burton would want to support it's own phenomenally (in recent years) successful side? Burton is a big town, roughly comparable to Barnsley if you include all the nearby villages and Swadlincote and yet we struggle to attract 1/4 to 1/3 of their gate. It is really our main stumbling block to further success, as the team out performs the fan base and would therefore struggle financially to reach a higher level.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2015 13:22:03 GMT
Any suggestions? I know a girl who works there so can pass ideas on. My only thought would be a constant lineup of chips ready under a hot light to speed up serving. Same with pies etc. They'll sell fast anyway.. I'm not sure it would increase revenue though. If people want a pie, they'll queue. To be honest I was thinking more about investing in physically widening the facility... I think my perception has been unrealistically skewed though (given that Oakwell is 3 x the capacity and a former Premier League ground!) by going to the Barnsley game last month, where the outlet for the away fans was very big and remarkably well staffed for our 300-400 attendance! Since the opportunity is there though my feedback is that on the odd occasion I've braved the queue for a half time coffee, the staff have been friendly and I like their Pirelli-branded attire! The food concessions were increased last season (on the Popside at least), but the time it takes to be served a pint at halftime has to be costing the club revenue. They need another, or a bigger bar with more staff OR do like they do in some Irish pubs and have a bunch of pints half ready and just needing to be topped up. Health and Safety would have a field day with that one though....
|
|
|
Post by brewster on Sept 15, 2015 13:46:01 GMT
I've now stopped going for a pint at half time unless we can talk someone in to going down at about 35 minutes to get them in.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2015 14:37:32 GMT
To be honest I was thinking more about investing in physically widening the facility... I think my perception has been unrealistically skewed though (given that Oakwell is 3 x the capacity and a former Premier League ground!) by going to the Barnsley game last month, where the outlet for the away fans was very big and remarkably well staffed for our 300-400 attendance! Since the opportunity is there though my feedback is that on the odd occasion I've braved the queue for a half time coffee, the staff have been friendly and I like their Pirelli-branded attire! The food concessions were increased last season (on the Popside at least), but the time it takes to be served a pint at halftime has to be costing the club revenue. They need another, or a bigger bar with more staff OR do like they do in some Irish pubs and have a bunch of pints half ready and just needing to be topped up. Health and Safety would have a field day with that one though.... Unless it has changed this season, you can prepay for your pint and it is ready for you at half time (I think anyway)
|
|
|
Post by observer on Sept 15, 2015 15:13:20 GMT
Prepay is a good idea
Honest opinion on the catering withing the seated stand is that they are lovely staff in terms of wanting to help and work at the club but very slow and no real plan of how to deal with queues quickly and effectively
And everything is made to order more or less.
There's no system or plan. Busier clubs have all their stuff wrapped and ready to serve. At Burton we are still cooking chips and putting into bread rolls or cooking burgers and doing the same
It works in non league etc but bigger you get you have to plan different.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2015 15:53:57 GMT
Hate to say it but I think that, for a standard league fixture, around 2200 is our ceiling in terms of home supporters. I'll now expand on that with a long and boring post as I'm on nights and have nothing better to do.
I've mentioned before about the generational and historical affect on our supporter base. If you dig out the demographics of football supporters I'm sure the average age of an adult football supporter at this moment in time would be something along the lines of 25 to 40 years old. Now consider where we were 20 years ago when people from that age range would've been either growing up and inheriting an allegiance to a club from a parent or seriously getting into football and drinking and going with their mates. Were they coming to Eton Park or were they getting on a train and going to the BBG/Pride Park/Villa Park or going into town to watch the Premier League on TV? I certainly fall into that demographic and I can tell you that 20 years ago I had no interest in Burton Albion and fell squarely into the latter category. I started coming in 2000 with a mate who almost had to drag me kicking and screaming to Eton Park. I came for a few years, fell away for a bit and only started coming back full time because I started working with a bloke in his 50s who became a very good mate and happpened to be a Brewer.
Consider that last sentence. "A bloke in his 50s." I might be way off on this but I reckon that we would, proportionally, have more people above that demographic of 25 to 40 than most clubs in the country simply because we were nowhere when they were all growing up and a sizeable chunk of the 40+ generation (watching my words carefully) fall squarely into the "Burton or Derby when either is at home" crowd which would also explain our dire away numbers. Ok, I accept that not everybody falls into those categories but I genuinely think that this is "rule of thumb" when it comes to us.
My own personal feeling is that another promotion could be potentially damaging to the club at this point in time because we'd go from being a small fish in a big pond to being a small fish in a gigantic ocean. Johnno is absolutely spot on when he says the club have outperfomed the fanbase and I think we're now at the point where the club need to almost reign it in slightly and grow with the next generation of Brewers. The good news is that I'm starting to see kids with Burton shirts on around my neck of the woods. The Community Trust do an absolutely stellar job getting the club out and about in the town and I also think that we as supporters carry an element of responsibility since because our club is so small (arguably still in the smallest 4 or 5 in the country) a lot of the time we are the face of the club. What DOESN'T help is the presence some of our supporters have on social media. In this day and age the first impression that people get of a club and what their supporters are like is on social media outlets. I know I do it for other clubs. Our representation in that respect is abysmal to the point where sometimes I think it's no wonder the people of Burton don't want to turn up on a Saturday. That rant is for another day though.
Sorry for the length. That's the first time I've ever said that, by the way. Hope you get the drift though. All replies in agreement or disagreement are welcome.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2015 17:27:38 GMT
The food concessions were increased last season (on the Popside at least), but the time it takes to be served a pint at halftime has to be costing the club revenue. They need another, or a bigger bar with more staff OR do like they do in some Irish pubs and have a bunch of pints half ready and just needing to be topped up. Health and Safety would have a field day with that one though.... Unless it has changed this season, you can prepay for your pint and it is ready for you at half time (I think anyway) While that is true (and hope not too many read or heed that news) it is not a viable solution for me. The small area where you collect pre-ordered drinks can hold 25, maybe 30 pints, and it is already sometimes hard to get there due to the lineups at the bar. If more people start to use that avenue then it will be more chaotic that ordering at the bar. The point is, people are still lined up 3-4 deep at the bar to buy a drink and that has got to be costing the club revenue. Brewster has said he stopped going and there has to be a lot more doing the same.
|
|
|
Post by claymillman on Sept 15, 2015 18:01:37 GMT
Blimey Spence, you really are dissecting us aren't you? I am sure there is a lot in what you say, but I (as you do), think the club is going the right way about our situation. This includes all the various community activities, plus very good local paper coverage and therefore publicity. Fortunately the club took steps to counter to a good degree our lack of supporters in the ground with the new ground and sound corporate income to help the club compete, whilst staying debt free. However the club creates it's own momentum, by appointing good managers who want to go out to attempt to win every game. This is how it has to be, and our Chairman has been so good at employing very good managers, we find ourselves at the dizzy heights of 3rd in League 1. If somehow the almost unbelievable happens and we are promoted again, we would indeed be minnows in a very big lake, and we could then struggle for sure, but we have to aim for the stars regardless. Any future difficulties we as a club then endure, we must deal with at that time. I am sure that Ben is considering as we chat, the various possibilities, and what we as a club can do if and when the time comes.
|
|