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Feb 4, 2019 18:58:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2019 18:58:51 GMT
I still think extra seating would help, however, where and how is not easy to do.
The family area is naturally best to be seated, but to do all the Popside would surely be prohibitive.
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Post by colstoncrawford on Feb 6, 2019 14:05:50 GMT
NobodyGood wrote: Definitely... It is a shame that we don't have that many fans, maybe it'll grow with time. Who knows!
It has grown with time. Simple fact.
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Feb 6, 2019 15:10:58 GMT
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Post by NobodyGood on Feb 6, 2019 15:10:58 GMT
NobodyGood wrote: Definitely... It is a shame that we don't have that many fans, maybe it'll grow with time. Who knows! It has grown with time. Simple fact. It has, depending what period you look at it over though. Average attendances are as follows since 2014/15: Leahue two 2014/15 - 3,237 League one 2015/16 - 4,089 Championship 2016/17 - 5,228 Championship 2017/18 - 4,645 League one 2018/19 - 3,228 Championship skewed somewhat by consistently higher away support. And obviously few more home fans to see bigger clubs. I'd say our fanbase is broadly stable with little change in either direction.
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Post by colstoncrawford on Feb 6, 2019 15:15:20 GMT
fair point. But I was one of about 600 when I started
*yep, there were thousands at Wellington Road at one time...but that really was a different time
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Post by jackbrewer on Feb 6, 2019 15:18:46 GMT
When I started at Wellington Street we used to have crowds round about 5000. Those were the days.
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Feb 6, 2019 15:23:15 GMT
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Post by NobodyGood on Feb 6, 2019 15:23:15 GMT
When I started at Wellington Street we used to have crowds round about 5000. Those were the days. I didn't even know where we played before Eton Park... Interesting, and crazy attendances! Football in the 60s and 70s did look better, in the few TV clips I see anyway, packed stands, raucous fans. Nowadays the premier league grounds are regularly less than full, and eerily quiet.
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Post by Norah on Feb 6, 2019 19:06:14 GMT
In one respect our success has worked against us increasing the fan base in some ways... Let me explain. In the old days going to watch the Brewers was a cheap way to watch footie but also the cheap and easy way to introduce your children to football: just wander or drive down to Elton Park, Park up by the ground or Elton Road and go to the game and it wouldn’t cost a fortune like at.... Derby County. That’s what we did about twenty years ago in what turned out to be a vain effort to get our son interested. Regardless of our failure though that’s the way the future fan base of a club is created if the ploy works. Now days it’s almost as cheap to go to that hellhole of a concrete non descriptive stadium at Derby... whatever they call it now. So why go to Burton some might question. I would go further. Clubs such as Mickleover Sports have taken a few fans away from us. The type of fan who enjoyed non league footie with the small club mentality. My husband, who for a few years was treasurer there went there because he felt that was the sort of small club that Burton Albion had been, but was no longer ( he is weird though) ... and then there is the Burtonian apathy....
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Feb 6, 2019 19:37:03 GMT
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Post by NobodyGood on Feb 6, 2019 19:37:03 GMT
It has, depending what period you look at it over though. Average attendances are as follows since 2014/15: Leahue two 2014/15 - 3,237 League one 2015/16 - 4,089 Championship 2016/17 - 5,228 Championship 2017/18 - 4,645 League one 2018/19 - 3,228 Championship skewed somewhat by consistently higher away support. And obviously few more home fans to see bigger clubs. I'd say our fanbase is broadly stable with little change in either direction. My apologies for the graveyard humour... but is it only me that notices in years between 2014/15 and 2018/19 the fan base has actually dropped by nine?!? Going back to the “joy” statistics and assuming our fan base is consistent , can we conclude that nine of our fans have died? It's the only logical explanation...
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Post by everard on Feb 6, 2019 19:57:36 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 20:36:31 GMT
As far as I can understand it, “safe standing” is merely standing but with your own specific space to stand and a fold down seat if you need one at any time (before, half time or perhaps for a rest during the match) and removes the risks of pushing from behind or in front of people. Basically it is standing. We need both this and seating though. I know that seated areas do “stand” to celebrate a goal and in anticipation of one coming, but if people in seated areas stand, it means that those who are unable to (for whatever reason) have their view blocked. (Aston Villa away for example).
I like both and wish I could change throughout the match. Like changing ends at half time. Then again, I’m VERY non-league.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 22:25:57 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...? We've done it before when we built the Pirelli, I think Ben sensed we were ready to make the next step. We'd already started attracting some real top quality players. The whole club shifted up a gear, even though in some areas we still lag behind. Ben got the timing spot on but let's not forget we pulled Man Utd out of the hat and it took that game to pay off the stadium, otherwise Ben would have been in debt. No wonder he's cautious to risk that again, when we've all got to admit, the crowds were disappointing last season when it seemed the novelty factor wore off for a lot of fans. My own view is we should do what we can to get another 500 seats. Football is moving in that direction and in my opinion it would help to attract the more mature fan base. Something that wouldn't do any harm at all. I hope we're professional enough behind the scenes to be using the online ticketing data, the number of phone enquiries and the number of times we've sold out and could have sold more seats. I'm not convinced we are though. The ticket office people are brilliant, lovely and helpful but they've never tried to "upsell" me once, even knowing that I'm loyal like that and if I have money, I'm happy to spend it on the club. There were a lot of occasions I rang to get extra seated tickets last season only to be told we'd sold out, again not once did they take any details and I don't think they made a note of how many I wanted. That leads me to think we've no data driven idea how many extra seats we could fill (if any). We miss a trick if that's the case. I get the feeling we want to try to push on as a club if at all possible. I think we got the taste for playing the bigger clubs and I think we liked it. I'm excited about the shape of the squad next season already and I'm looking forward to see how the manager rebuilds a defence that needs to concede less goals. The team deserves to be playing in front of a couple hundred more than they are now, the football they are producing at times (admittedly without the results to back it up) is very good to watch and well worth the price of a ticket.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 22:33:44 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...? I might be wrong but I think the rule is you must be all seater for your third season in the championship, even if you're relegated and bounce back. I think we've had our 2 seasons grace. If we want to get back to the Championnship the ground would have to be improved.
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Feb 6, 2019 22:52:10 GMT
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Post by everard on Feb 6, 2019 22:52:10 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...? I might be wrong but I think the rule is you must be all seater for your third season in the championship, even if you're relegated and bounce back. I think we've had our 2 seasons grace. If we want to get back to the Championnship the ground would have to be improved. cbh1 is usually good with rules and regulations stuff... Maybe Ian can help us out with this...?
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Feb 6, 2019 23:22:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 23:22:16 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...? I might be wrong but I think the rule is you must be all seater for your third season in the championship, even if you're relegated and bounce back. I think we've had our 2 seasons grace. If we want to get back to the Championnship the ground would have to be improved. You need to be all seater in the Championship after 3 seasons there. So, if we did get promoted, that would be our last with standing areas under the current regulations. That said Brentford are seemingly on track for their 78th consecutive season in the Championship with terracing. Then again Bolton don't pay their players and Birmingham lost £37 million, so a level playing field is not possible...
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Post by dcpedigree on Feb 7, 2019 7:50:23 GMT
I'm with Ianmc.. I think one thing that would grow our fan base over time is more seats. I'm sure they'd appeal to more families and old 'uns who have reached a time when 90 mins standing is getting difficult.. You cannot wait until you've disappointed and turned away three or nine hundred people for two or three months/seasons before you're convinced of demand.. I'd encourage Ben to bring forward plans to maybe try to get a standing tier above a seating tier (say 1-2000 seats) along the popside (or viceversa) whatever works with £ sums (if anything does) Maybe some of those half and half things but I'm not convinced they're a compromise that suits either standers or sitters Then with a plan and a target price you can have a go at fundraising it... Or are we convinced any stadium improvements on this scale would be beyond our means? Would trying to fund them compromise our fortunes on the pitch? Perhaps we need 5 or 6 continuous seasons in the Championship to fund increased seating capacity... But then again would more seats generate more revenue to fund more seats.. Chickens or eggs...? Totally agree, although i love the old fashion way of watching football, i too need a seat. We are living longer!. My main reason for more seats is being able to attract new fans. Bringing in schools/clubs/organizations in free of charge from the surrounding areas or £1 for a kid. You cant entertain these marketing ideas in this day and age by asking a family or a school to look after children in a packed terrace where they cant keep track of the kids, health and safety and all that. We have to move with the times to attract more support and that is more seating, it just wont work any other way. Also family life is different now, time is precious both parents work, so going out with the kids and entertaining is more of a joint family experience. We need to cater for this. more seats please please please. we will have the opportunity to double our gate which ever league we are in , i have no doubt.
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Feb 7, 2019 8:13:55 GMT
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Post by NobodyGood on Feb 7, 2019 8:13:55 GMT
I'd, controversially, make the behind the goal bit seated and leave popside as is. The people behind the goal who want to stand, can, in the popside, I guess that'd move our rowdy bunch maybe to the halfway line or up by the away fans.
Wouldn't go down well with a number of fans though. But I think either will annoy certain people. Can't please everyone.
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Feb 7, 2019 9:25:32 GMT
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Post by dcpedigree on Feb 7, 2019 9:25:32 GMT
Sorry my reply to everard ended up being part of his quote. Rubbish at this. here it is seperated Totally agree, although i love the old fashion way of watching football, i too need a seat. We are living longer!. My main reason for more seats is being able to attract new fans. Bringing in schools/clubs/organizations in free of charge from the surrounding areas or £1 for a kid. You cant entertain these marketing ideas in this day and age by asking a family or a school to look after children in a packed terrace where they cant keep track of the kids, health and safety and all that. We have to move with the times to attract more support and that is more seating, it just wont work any other way. Also family life is different now, time is precious both parents work, so going out with the kids and entertaining is more of a joint family experience. We need to cater for this. more seats please please please. we will have the opportunity to double our gate which ever league we are in , i have no doubt. Read more: burtonbrewers.proboards.com/thread/3691/fan-base#ixzz5eprhbJRY
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Feb 7, 2019 10:04:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 10:04:50 GMT
Sorry my reply to everard ended up being part of his quote. Rubbish at this. here it is seperated Totally agree, although i love the old fashion way of watching football, i too need a seat. We are living longer!. My main reason for more seats is being able to attract new fans. Bringing in schools/clubs/organizations in free of charge from the surrounding areas or £1 for a kid. You cant entertain these marketing ideas in this day and age by asking a family or a school to look after children in a packed terrace where they cant keep track of the kids, health and safety and all that. We have to move with the times to attract more support and that is more seating, it just wont work any other way. Also family life is different now, time is precious both parents work, so going out with the kids and entertaining is more of a joint family experience. We need to cater for this. more seats please please please. we will have the opportunity to double our gate which ever league we are in , i have no doubt. Read more: burtonbrewers.proboards.com/thread/3691/fan-base#ixzz5eprhbJRYI agree with most of this, problem is finding the investment to do it and of course many people will be dismayed at the loss of terracing. Also the Popside is much shallower than the Main stand, low seating is not great IMHO.
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Post by colstoncrawford on Feb 7, 2019 10:14:55 GMT
Some interesting points here. Made me realise my own self interest. I like standing because traditionally we stood at football and we're one of the last few where you still can in the FL. But that's me and I'm not the future, not in terms of bringing offspring along and getting them interested anyway (my grandson's not fussed about football). A guy called Tom who I know only from standing near him on the Popside now sits down... because he brings his grandson, which rather backs up some of the points above. Certainly serious food for thought for Ben...
* Brentford seem to have got away with it by promising they're about to build a new ground....honest... very soon... no, really
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 10:44:01 GMT
Some interesting points here. Made me realise my own self interest. I like standing because traditionally we stood at football and we're one of the last few where you still can in the FL. But that's me and I'm not the future, not in terms of bringing offspring along and getting them interested anyway (my grandson's not fussed about football). A guy called Tom who I know only from standing near him on the Popside now sits down... because he brings his grandson, which rather backs up some of the points above. Certainly serious food for thought for Ben... * Brentford seem to have got away with it by promising they're about to build a new ground....honest... very soon... no, reallyThey have actually started building now apparently... Ready for the 2020/21 season, or if they have used the same company building Spurs ground 2047/48. newstadium.brentfordfc.com/news/more-views-our-new-homeI am in the same category as you Colston, prefer to stand, but I do occasionally sit and find it quite comfortable. Im wondering whether the Popside could have fixed seating for the first 3 or 4 rows and safe standing 'seating' the back few rows thereby allowing those that want to to continue to stand without impeding the view. Maybe the priority though is to make the away end all seater, thereby allowing the main stand to be home seating only - that frees up around 300 seats and removes the need for some seats to be unused for segregation purposes. That would be enough room then for a family area at the home end of the ground. All of the options require a good deal of investment though. Not sure that money is readily available.
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