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Post by trevor1946 on Jan 16, 2019 13:39:57 GMT
You know you say the same thing over and over, it is called tunnel vision ,he is the manager and will assess how the game went in his interviews, if you want to make a statement claiming how well the team have played,that's fine, ,But you are a waste of time,you make your point again and again i think to wind people up. Clough has been in football since he was 7 in the profesional game,and unless you haven't clicked on yet,it is played in the public eye,and most fans are not stupid. They don't know the facts ,but they have their own judgement were the problems are .Poor old Nigel,for him to take responsibility for,players antic on the pitch coming on and kicking them up the backside,not a option He can only do that when they come off the pitch, and he does, He lets them know what he thinks, If they object they know were his office is. i must say the chances missed,the bad pass leading up to the penalty,the ball going in through collins legs, Brayford being out paced.conceding a goal in injury time I leave you to take the positives=====oh you did blame the manager. The manager will be held to account by the club. come May,targets will have been set . Not silly ones made up by some fans,but realistic aims for the brewers.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2019 14:26:56 GMT
You know you say the same thing over and over, it is called tunnel vision ,he is the manager and will assess how the game went in his interviews, if you want to make a statement claiming how well the team have played,that's fine, ,But you are a waste of time,you make your point again and again i think to wind people up. Clough has been in football since he was 7 in the profesional game,and unless you haven't clicked on yet,it is played in the public eye,and most fans are not stupid. They don't know the facts ,but they have their own judgement were the problems are .Poor old Nigel,for him to take responsibility for,players antic on the pitch coming on and kicking them up the backside,not a option He can only do that when they come off the pitch, and he does, He lets them know what he thinks, If they object they know were his office is. i must say the chances missed,the bad pass leading up to the penalty,the ball going in through collins legs, Brayford being out paced.conceding a goal in injury time I leave you to take the positives=====oh you did blame the manager. The manager will be held to account by the club. come May,targets will have been set . Not silly ones made up by some fans,but realistic aims for the brewers. If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2019 21:25:06 GMT
You know you say the same thing over and over, it is called tunnel vision ,he is the manager and will assess how the game went in his interviews, if you want to make a statement claiming how well the team have played,that's fine, ,But you are a waste of time,you make your point again and again i think to wind people up. Clough has been in football since he was 7 in the profesional game,and unless you haven't clicked on yet,it is played in the public eye,and most fans are not stupid. They don't know the facts ,but they have their own judgement were the problems are .Poor old Nigel,for him to take responsibility for,players antic on the pitch coming on and kicking them up the backside,not a option He can only do that when they come off the pitch, and he does, He lets them know what he thinks, If they object they know were his office is. i must say the chances missed,the bad pass leading up to the penalty,the ball going in through collins legs, Brayford being out paced.conceding a goal in injury time I leave you to take the positives=====oh you did blame the manager. The manager will be held to account by the club. come May,targets will have been set . Not silly ones made up by some fans,but realistic aims for the brewers. If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91. I am certain that Ben Robinson does indeed hold Nigel Clough to account for the performance of the team on the pitch. Luckily Ben does using the knowledge and context of the relative resources and support that the club has and who it is competing against. He has a good record. As does Clough. And I take it that it did not pass you by that Bolton are not paying players and Birmingham lost £37 million last year? All part of that context.
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Post by bobgauden on Jan 16, 2019 22:03:28 GMT
You know you say the same thing over and over, it is called tunnel vision ,he is the manager and will assess how the game went in his interviews, if you want to make a statement claiming how well the team have played,that's fine, ,But you are a waste of time,you make your point again and again i think to wind people up. Clough has been in football since he was 7 in the profesional game,and unless you haven't clicked on yet,it is played in the public eye,and most fans are not stupid. They don't know the facts ,but they have their own judgement were the problems are .Poor old Nigel,for him to take responsibility for,players antic on the pitch coming on and kicking them up the backside,not a option He can only do that when they come off the pitch, and he does, He lets them know what he thinks, If they object they know were his office is. i must say the chances missed,the bad pass leading up to the penalty,the ball going in through collins legs, Brayford being out paced.conceding a goal in injury time I leave you to take the positives=====oh you did blame the manager. The manager will be held to account by the club. come May,targets will have been set . Not silly ones made up by some fans,but realistic aims for the brewers. If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91. I understand the point you're making Royston, you know the score here by now that any tinge of criticism will always be twisted into a futile agenda against the manager and his position.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2019 22:24:09 GMT
If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91. I understand the point you're making Royston, you know the score here by now that any tinge of criticism will always be twisted into a futile agenda against the manager and his position. I was responding to one point only about Nigel Clough not being held to account by our club (as Ben is the owner/Chairman, I don't think it was a leap to assume that is who Royston was talking about). That was, in my opinion, an unfair assessment and consequently I used some facts to support my opinion.
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Post by swaddy Dave on Jan 17, 2019 6:48:06 GMT
You know you say the same thing over and over, it is called tunnel vision ,he is the manager and will assess how the game went in his interviews, if you want to make a statement claiming how well the team have played,that's fine, ,But you are a waste of time,you make your point again and again i think to wind people up. Clough has been in football since he was 7 in the profesional game,and unless you haven't clicked on yet,it is played in the public eye,and most fans are not stupid. They don't know the facts ,but they have their own judgement were the problems are .Poor old Nigel,for him to take responsibility for,players antic on the pitch coming on and kicking them up the backside,not a option He can only do that when they come off the pitch, and he does, He lets them know what he thinks, If they object they know were his office is. i must say the chances missed,the bad pass leading up to the penalty,the ball going in through collins legs, Brayford being out paced.conceding a goal in injury time I leave you to take the positives=====oh you did blame the manager. The manager will be held to account by the club. come May,targets will have been set . Not silly ones made up by some fans,but realistic aims for the brewers. If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91.
Hear, heat to that.
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Post by insideleft on Jan 17, 2019 9:42:50 GMT
If you are going to quote anything I have pisted make sure its accurate at least? Otherwise you may fall into the same trap as the manager in making assertions about players which are not correct but suit the points he wishes to make. Contrary to the nonsense you have posted above, I did not blame the manager for the loss Saturday. What I did was criticise the managers post match reaction to the loss. I would have thought that even you with rose tinted glasses on would understand the difference. Apparently not. In response to the point you make about the manager being held to account by the club. This is where we really do differ im afraid and where you and many other very loyal supporters are at best so loyal and at worst niave. NC will never be held to account be our club. He will leave as he did before leave when he wishes to. If he was going to be held to account be the club it would have been last season when we went 7months without winning a home game and were relegated. In any other club in the land NC would have lost his job. That makes our club different to all other 91. I understand the point you're making Royston, you know the score here by now that any tinge of criticism will always be twisted into a futile agenda against the manager and his position. I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 11:05:33 GMT
I understand the point you're making Royston, you know the score here by now that any tinge of criticism will always be twisted into a futile agenda against the manager and his position. I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong .
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 11:10:34 GMT
I understand the point you're making Royston, you know the score here by now that any tinge of criticism will always be twisted into a futile agenda against the manager and his position. I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong Im big enough and ugly enough to take the backlash over my reaction to the managers public criticism of his own senior players that no an issue to me but let me ask you to consider this one point for a minute which kind of encapsulates my concerns about NC’s behaviour after saturday He said he wasnt worried particularly about us going fwd but it was the defence who were costing us games and needs changes? Im no genius but if we have a defender say like Ben Turner who this season has a win level of 42% in league games and the team as a whole has a win level of 37% in league games can you explain to me and others how Ben can be costing us games as my maths tell me we win more when hes in the side??? The same point can be made for Jake aswell. Funny that isnt it. Seems to suggest that NC is wrong?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 11:14:12 GMT
I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong This is my first post. I’ve read this forum for years. And I must say I agree with bob and Royston here. Is Nigel Clough above criticism on this forum? He’s a man who basically employs all his ex players because they are all yes men and know they have it easy if he’s there manager. He can’t manage people who are abit different and don’t tow his line. Look at Liam Boyce this season. It looks to me like he’s stop playing for the manager. He should be our best player and have about 20 goals but instead looks disinterested and like he’s not trying. Look at the coaching staff situation. Talk about yes men. Nigel Clough is someone who doesn’t like being challenged. You can tell that from his interviews. His interview after the gillingham game was amateurish and hard to listen to without cringing. Thank you for your post. I am pleased others have a more rounded view
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Post by NobodyGood on Jan 17, 2019 11:53:47 GMT
I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong This is my first post. I’ve read this forum for years. And I must say I agree with bob and Royston here. Is Nigel Clough above criticism on this forum? He’s a man who basically employs all his ex players because they are all yes men and know they have it easy if he’s there manager. He can’t manage people who are abit different and don’t tow his line. Look at Liam Boyce this season. It looks to me like he’s stop playing for the manager. He should be our best player and have about 20 goals but instead looks disinterested and like he’s not trying. Look at the coaching staff situation. Talk about yes men. Nigel Clough is someone who doesn’t like being challenged. You can tell that from his interviews. His interview after the gillingham game was amateurish and hard to listen to without cringing. In answer to your first question, it's no. He can be criticised... But you should expect a fiesty response from a few if you do 😁
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 12:22:37 GMT
One of the many things that infuriates me about forums and social media is when someone offers an alternative response to a contentious post, the originator of the post (or their supporters) claim that they are not being allowed to have an opinion! You expressed your opinion and others expressed theirs. There is no problem with that and no conspiracy against anti-Clough (for example) opinions.
Just to add - “disinterested” does not mean the same thing as “uninterested”. Not being pedantic, I just want to be able to use the correct word without being misunderstood.
Secondly, an opinion which agrees with your own is not necessarily “more rounded” than any other opinion. It’s just your personal bias.
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Post by NobodyGood on Jan 17, 2019 12:40:56 GMT
One of the many things that infuriates me about forums and social media is when someone offers an alternative response to a contentious post, the originator of the post (or their supporters) claim that they are not being allowed to have an opinion! You expressed your opinion and others expressed theirs. There is no problem with that and no conspiracy against anti-Clough (for example) opinions. Just to add - “disinterested” does not mean the same thing as “uninterested”. Not being pedantic, I just want to be able to use the correct word without being misunderstood. Secondly, an opinion which agrees with your own is not necessarily “more rounded” than any other opinion. It’s just your personal bias. Indeed but here it does seem to become an argument rather than a discussion a lot of the time. Happens quite regularly but less so than usual.
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emnez
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Post by emnez on Jan 17, 2019 12:49:59 GMT
One of the many things that infuriates me about forums and social media is when someone offers an alternative response to a contentious post, the originator of the post (or their supporters) claim that they are not being allowed to have an opinion! You expressed your opinion and others expressed theirs. There is no problem with that and no conspiracy against anti-Clough (for example) opinions. Just to add - “disinterested” does not mean the same thing as “uninterested”. Not being pedantic, I just want to be able to use the correct word without being misunderstood. Secondly, an opinion which agrees with your own is not necessarily “more rounded” than any other opinion. It’s just your personal bias. 100% agree Ilson folk on all forums get shirty when others put a different point of view and I find this very immature.Much as I support NC,Brays and Bucko they are not immune from the critics as far as I am concerned.Let us all have an opinion without sarcastic and arrogant replies and respect fellow supporters posts or are we going down the facebook road which I detest.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 12:51:52 GMT
One of the many things that infuriates me about forums and social media is when someone offers an alternative response to a contentious post, the originator of the post (or their supporters) claim that they are not being allowed to have an opinion! You expressed your opinion and others expressed theirs. There is no problem with that and no conspiracy against anti-Clough (for example) opinions. Just to add - “disinterested” does not mean the same thing as “uninterested”. Not being pedantic, I just want to be able to use the correct word without being misunderstood. Secondly, an opinion which agrees with your own is not necessarily “more rounded” than any other opinion. It’s just your personal bias. Indeed but here it does seem to become an argument rather than a discussion a lot of the time. Happens quite regularly but less so than usual. There are some who feel that Clough can do no wrong whatever happens, but I think they are few in number. There is a sizeable minority who will seek every opportunity they can find to be critical of him. These two opposing opinions are always likely to clash into argumentation because both think they are right and that the other is wrong and no amount of discussion will change either view. Where I and I think most others on here are is that we can see when things have gone wrong, bad decisions made etc but we accept that this happens from time to time and that, in most cases, things are generally going well for the club and we are happy to be patient. Hackles get raised though when blanket statements are made which disguise as facts (from both sides) rather than what they are, which is opinions. I try not to get too upset these days. I accept that there is a sizeable and very vocal minority of supporters who want Clough out and won’t be happy until he has gone. They also appear to have a personal dislike for those who support the management (and vice versa). I think it would be easier if, rather than lengthy posts (like this one) we just had a good “oh yes he is” “oh no he isn’t” thread and move all of the posts there out of the way.
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Post by insideleft on Jan 17, 2019 14:44:52 GMT
I think Bobgauden that’s a rather condescending view toward posters on this forum.
There is no need to twist anything Royston says it’s there bang on in front of you……………Since Saturday’s game he has been relentless in his criticism of Cloughie’s management style……………talks absolute rubbish, makes sweeping generalisations about the season…blames, calls and criticises players to the media……blames everyone but himself…….petulant nonsense…..deluded……..constantly plays players out of position…..crazy decisions costing us as many points as the defence……acting like a spoilt kid… petulant criticism of individuals...
All that in thus far a pleasing season, good football, great cup run, comfortable mid table.
In an 85 post thread he enjoys no support……it’s a lone view …..bar a “Like” from Fred Andrews. Welcome back Fred we must have lost
It’s interesting to get different views on here, no problem with Royston, opinion is valued but I think he’s made his point even if it wrong Im big enough and ugly enough to take the backlash over my reaction to the managers public criticism of his own senior players that no an issue to me but let me ask you to consider this one point for a minute which kind of encapsulates my concerns about NC’s behaviour after saturday He said he wasnt worried particularly about us going fwd but it was the defence who were costing us games and needs changes? Im no genius but if we have a defender say like Ben Turner who this season has a win level of 42% in league games and the team as a whole has a win level of 37% in league games can you explain to me and others how Ben can be costing us games as my maths tell me we win more when hes in the side??? The same point can be made for Jake aswell. Funny that isnt it. Seems to suggest that NC is wrong? I’ll be brief Royston and the last word from me on it. I read the Burton Mail and Derby Eevening paper reports.
I listened to the Radio Derby 5 minute after match interview. I did not read or hear any of the criticism you raise. Not remotely. Not one word. Cloughie talked constructively and honestly about the game. He did blame the 3rd goal on defensive frailties and he did observe Quinny making an error that led to the 2nd goal. Fair enough. Other than that a perfectly normal interview bearing in mind he also is frustrated and has some effwit in front of him with a mike in his face.
So hence my post.
Perhaps consider reviewing your comments alongside the media comment you post about. I think it fair to say you do exaggerate the truth a touch? That’s it. I'm off to row about Brexit.
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Post by trevor1946 on Jan 17, 2019 16:38:32 GMT
Oh you are joking royston to revue a comment,no way he repeats it to wear you down,and because he has time on his hands --it works, I know in religion or politics to change a view is shucks one long debate,and you go away knowing it is a waste of time, i would say looking at Burtons history since 2012/13 play offs. until 2018/19 we have had 5 years of unbelievable achievements and shared many wonderful moments.Rowett gave us 2 playoffs==J-F-H a league 2 championship and Clough in his second phase,Automatic promotion to the Championship, against all odds 2 seasons in the championship,A last minute relegation,and a league cup semi final,and hopefully a place in league 1. In 5 seasons, a time burton Albion fc will not forget,and the magic the Brewers brought to the game most fans especially from non league clubs,can only sit back and admire .Rowett never quite did it and then jumped ship---J_F_H_ gave us 1 year a championship then jumped ship. 1 automatic promotion==2 seasons of championship football . hopefully stability in league 1--and royston feel he needs to learn how to hold a dressing room together I have to laugh .I see ilson has set up a post for him to get him of game sites==sorry just give up,
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